x Welsh Tract Publications: ELDER JOHN GANO CALLED TO THE MINISTRY...

Translate

Historic

Historic

Sunday, October 7, 2018

ELDER JOHN GANO CALLED TO THE MINISTRY...

Pulpit Warwick Old School Baptist Meeting House NY
After I had joined the church, I was treated more like an old, than a young member. I was soon made a messenger to the association; and to the Scotch Plains church, with Elder J. Stout Probably John Stout mentioned in the Philadelphia Associational Minutes, to obtain stated supplies to keep up communion seasons from Mr. Miller, one of the most useful ministers in that day.


Hopewell church had no stated settled minister. Some time after, we were sent to Southampton church, to obtain a worthy young minister that was newly come into the ministry; Mr. Isaac Eaton. After obtaining consent from the church, by his request, we went to Montgomery to his "father" Was an early member of Montgomery and the first pastor of New Britain ; was admitted to membership from Welsh Tract in June, 1721. He was twice married. His first wife was Gwen Morgan, who died in 1723. On the 17th of March, 1724, he married Uriah Humphrey, "Uriah" being then a woman's name. She came from Pennypack. She survived her husband ten years, or till 1759. The Eaton family first settled in Lower Dublin, Philadelphia, where George Eaton purchased land in 1095. Joseph Eaton was born in Nantmel, Radnorshire,Wales, August 25th, 1679. In 1686, when a child of seven, he was brought to America. About 1721 he bought 353 acres, mostly lying in Montgomery township, a small portion in New Britain. It was along the present State road, comprising the present farms of John Roberts, Ephraim Kratz, Alfred Comly and Albert Arthur. His home was on the site of the Arthur farmhouse. Eaton was called to the 'ministry in 1722, and was ordained in 1727, when a man of middle age. He often preached at Montgomery as the assistant of Griffith, and became the minister at New Britain in 1744, preaching there for five years. He lived over four miles distant, and we may suppose that he preached but once a Sunday. He took an active part in sustaining the side of New Britain in the dispute with Montgomery. His death took place April 1st, 1749, at the age of seventy.", who was an old minister there, whose approbation we also obtained. He was not only a great acquisition and a useful minister to Hopewell church, but to the churches all around. God's power attended the word, a considerable addition was made to the church, and numbers were added. I was also blessed with a judicious and "useful minister and friend" most likely Elder Isaac Eaton", who was able to instruct me in the classics, and who was desirous to do it. I
Montgomery Baptist Meeting House today
endeavoured to arrange matters, and devote myself to study. I began, in the hopes of surmounting many difficulties. An awful sense of the greatness of the work of the ministry, and that I might be able to preach with success, if I made some advances in study, induced me to cultivate an acquaintance with literature. I shuddered at the thought of becoming a preacher, and finally relinquished it.


I commenced a piece of business, and engaged a man to assist me in it, which I did merely to protract my studies. The young man falling sick the morning we designed to begin, counteracted my resolution of delaying my studies. I however looked upon it as the hand of providence. My Father called on me, that morning, to attend family worship. The chapter I read, administered such conviction to my soul, that I was induced to relinquish the business I had undertaken. I went that day and began the study of the Latin Grammar, and probably, for the first three months, made as great proficiency as any person. But I was so terrified with the importance of the ministerial work, and conceiving that neither providence, nature, or grace, had qualified me for that arduous office, that I determined to relinquish the idea, and return home, and settle myself in a situation, when it would be impossible to prosecute my studies; and of course the ministry. I meant, however, to live a steady and uniform christian life. I was much in prayer, and enjoyed a nearness to God in his word. His promises were precious; the doctrines opened and comforted my soul, I began to think of a companion for life, but was entirely at a loss for an object; for although I had kept much company, yet from my conversion till now, (nearly three years,) it was of a religious kind. 

I now joined in the purchase of a plantation, by which I was involved in debt, which I expected to adjust by the proceeds of the farm. Here my conscience dictated my duty to implore the direction of God, and acknowledge him in all my ways, I determined to spend the night in prayers to God, and accordingly went to a solitary place; that whether my prayers were mental or vocal, they might be out of the reach of the human ear. While I was on my knees, imploring the direction of God, these words powerfully impressed my mind: "Go forth and preach the Gospel." I remained on my knees pondering over them for some time, and begged of God not to suffer me to be deluded, and that every spirit might be restrained but his own. These words followed in my mind with equal force: "It is I, be not afraid—be not faithless, but believing;" which words, and others similar to them, reiterated in my soul. I rose, confounded; my breast heaved with oppression. I pondered again, and, at length, spoke out. I raised many objections;—my present circumstances;—my weakness and my vileness;—but all these objections were so entirely answered in Christ's sufficiency, and fullness of his promises, that I did not dare to raise any more. 

I thought, for a moment, of yielding, and walked to the house; when a new difficulty seized my mind:—that I must look to God for a determination. I withdrew again a distance off. and fell down as before; I think I may say, with the deepest reverence, and anxiety of mind for direction ; and to be saved from delusion, obstinacy, or presumption; and that I might not attribute those things to God which arose from the works of the devil; or those things to the devil, which came from God. 

In this posture, these words seized upon my mind : "Thou shalt speak to many people." "I will send thee far hence? K Say not I am a child, I will be with thee." "I will be with thy lips." "And thou shalt speak to all, to whom I send thee." "I have made thee this day, a brazen wall ari an iron sinew." And many more passages of scripture followed in my mind, till I was obliged to cry out, "it is enough, I will doubt no more." With this resolution, I arose, went to the house, and at a late hour of night went to bed. 

But alas! wretch that I was, and still am, I scarcely laid my head on the pillow, before such an opposition again rose in my mind against the work, and even against God for calling me to it, that I even wished for death. But oh! the dismal hours which seized my mind; the temptations and awful suggestions on the the one hand, and the promises and directions from God's word on the other, alternately, that I think I may call it the most excruciating night, that my soul ever experienced. 

Although it is fifty years since, the sensations I then felt are still fresh upon my memory; and, even now, while writing, give me an uncommon feeling. It is with shame that I write, that nearly two years elapsed, before my pride, my obstinacy, and my unbelief, were so conquered, that I could fully yield to the clearest conviction. It deprived me of much sleep, and all the cravings of nature;—and my body was emaciated. Yet, I frequently had seasons of great comfort, and repeated promises. I concluded at times, to die under these impressions, rather than yield. Frequently, when I would endeavour to pray, these texts would bear on my mind: "I have told you and ye did not hear, wherefore will ye hear it again." "Why will you be stricken any more, ye will revolt more and more." I could not conceal my anxiety of mind, although I endeavoured to do it, as much as possible, by retirement and silence; but my most intimate religious friends would discover it.

I became more industrious, and exercised myself a great deal. One day I went early into the field, to plough it free from stumps and stones. Soon after I started, this text weighed heavily on my mind: "Warn the people, or their blood will I require at your hands." The pangs which afflicted me so heavily, that, although it rained plentifully, I was insensible of it. Paul's expressions took such hold of my thoughts, that I regarded not what I was about. "If I do this willingly, I have my reward, but if not a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me." '' Necessity is laid upon me, woe is me if I preach not the gospel." One objection more arose in my mind;—that providence was against it, and God's spirit and providence generally accorded. If the church should call me, and I could extricate myself from my worldly concerns, I should devote myself to the duty of the ministry.

About this time, Mr. Eaton [1725-1772] came to see and converse with me. He took an opportunity, privately, to inform me, that he had for a long time observed an appearance of my mind being much depressed. That he thought it his duty to enquire, and mine to divulge, what it was; whether he or the church, had done anything to make me dissatisfied. I told him, I had no reason to complain; what was between God and my own soul, I did not wish to disclose to any person whatever. I was, however, constrained to give him some account, for which I was afterwards very sorry, although he gave me tender and faithful advice. 

The next church meeting, he called me aside, and told me he thought it his duty to mention me to the church; and if they thought proper to examine me, he would be satisfied. I begged him to desist for that time. He replied it was his duty, and he should do it. I found great reluctance in this procedure. They examined me, gave me a text, and appointed a time for me to preach before the church. They left it to me, that, if, after I had preached, I chose to devote my time to study, they would submit to it; otherwise, they should continue my trials. Providence opened the way, and, in a short time after, I went to studying, in which I continued some years, and sincerely felt as if I was in the performance of my duty.

Although my studies were dry, yet I had intervals of much spiritual comfort. One or two instances I must mention. My application to study was close, and the change of life from an industrious and stirring, to a sedentary one, probably was the cause of a severe fit of sickness. I had a high fever and was in much pain of body; but the pain of mind, for some time, so far exceeded it, and being exhausted by weakness, that I was tempted to think, if I was in my duty, I should not be impeded by Providence. The conflict was severe for some time; but through the grace of God, I had such establishing views of an interest in Christ, the well ordered covenant of grace, and the doctrines and promises of the gospel, that I supposed my soul was fixed firm on that eternal rock.

After my recovery, I prosecuted my studies, and used more exercise. The gentleman, under whom I studied, was a Presbyterian minister, from the State of Connecticut. He had, at that time, a number of youth studying the classics. The class to which I belonged were studying the Greek New Testament In 1762 William Smith described four levels in the Latin and Greek School: First form or stage - included grammar and conjugation, vocabulary, and beginning of writing in Latin. Readings were Senentiae Pueriles, Cordery, Aesop and Erasmus. English writing, reading and speaking were continued as well. Second stage - included Latin grammar, exercises and writing. Readings were Selectae e veteri Testamento, Selectae e Profanis Auctoribus, Eurtopius, Nepos, and Metamorphosis. Third stage - included geography and chronology as well as exercises and writing. Readings were Metamorphosis (cont.), Virgil with Parsody, Caesar's Comment, Sallust, Greek Testament. Fourth stage - included review of Virgil, reading of Horace, Terence, Livy, Lucian, and the beginning of Xenophon or Homer.: reading that chapter in John where Christ told Peter, “he that is washed needeth not, save to wash his feet, but is clean every whit:” and although it was not my verse to read, the master stopped the scholar, and turned to me, and said—“as we think differently of baptism, do you not think that these words suggest strongly, that a little water is as well as a great deal.” I replied, that they were as much in favour of sprinkling, as any in the bible. This abrupt answer, caused him to order the class back to their studies; but he detained me, to reason with me. I instantly made a confession, that I had been inadvertent, and that for all his liberal treatment to me he deserved a more submissive reply. He still persisted, and told me my arguments were weak. I replied, that I was not on an equal footing with him, I had been an aggressor, I was his pupil, and was afraid he felt injured at my offence, and wished him to pass it over as a piece of inadvertence. He still insisted, and promised, that in the debate, he would allow me to be on an equal footing with himself. As I could not avoid it, we were closely engaged till night. 

In the morning, when I went to school, he handed me this thesis: “That which God has once commanded, and never forbidden, remains a duty, and cannot be sinful.” I saw, that it alluded to children being taken into the Jewish church with their parents. I wished to avoid any further debate. I asked till noon to fill up the thesis—and filled it thus: “But God has commanded the seventh day as a Sabbath, and never forbidden it, and therefore it remains a duty and cannot be sin." This he called me to defend. This ended our former dispute.
Aaron Burr (1756-1836)

Princeton College, was at that time kept in Newark, New-Jersey; and governed by President Burr, with whom I was a great favorite. I frequently attended their public examinations, and had encouragement from the President, that I might enter college if I chose, when found upon examination to be fit for it. I found my advantages great, not being confined to any particular class, but was at liberty to make all the progress I was able to, in any branch of study. I intended, when I did enter, to enter the senior class; but unfortunately I was taken sick, before I had made but very little progress in the classics. My sickness was probably owing to my too close application to study, and the want of exercise. The doctors and my friends, advised me to take a journey, and relax my mind from study.

Mr. Miller, of Scotch Plains, and Mr.Thomas, of Montgomery, were appointed by the association to travel into Virginia, pursuant to two applications;—One from Opocken, where one Loveall, an Arminian preacher, had baptised a number of persons, and had established a church. But he being licentious in his life, was turned out of the church, and went off. When they discovered themselves destitute, and without fellowship, they applied for advice and assistance to the association; and promised that they would comply with any direction. 

Mr. Miller, had formerly visited these people in some of his journeys; and God had blessed his labours, by the conversion of several souls. The other application was from a young church, constituted by Mr. Thomas, which had no ministerial assistance; and which wanted the ordinances administered. A Mr. Sutton, from Old-Town, and myself, accompanied the minister, as far as the Potomac, where the roads separated;—one to Opocken, the other to Blue-ridge, or Kotockton. Here the ministers concluded to separate for the present. Mr. Sutton, to go with Mr. Miller, and myself to go with Mr, Thomas. We were to spend the next Lord's-day in separate towns, and the Wednesday following to meet at Opocken.

Mr. Miller, appointed a meeting in the evening. We put up at a tavern, where there was a noisy profane company. It being in the evening when we arrived, I called for the landlord, and asked if we could have a room apart from those people. He said we could; I asked him to shew us the room, and then gave orders respecting our horses. Through favour to us, he stopped into their room to still them, which so offended them, that they instantly burst into our room, and one of them demanded, with some imprecations, if we were New-lights a member of a group favoring revivalism and emotionalism in religion (as in Congregational, Presbyterian, and Baptist Churches) during and following the American revival movement of 1740–42 — compare old light. I told him we were civil travellers, and neither wished to disturb them, nor be disturbed ourselves. He held his fist over my head and pointed to one of his comrades, and said, that man can beat any one in the room. I replied, that he looked much more like a man, than he acted; and that I dared to say, he and the rest of the gentlemen were ashamed of his company and conduct.  

At this instant the landlord came in. I immediately desired him to turn that fellow out of the room, that we might converse with the others. He did so. I then began with the others. I told them, that in that man, we had a striking instance of the depravity of human nature.—That it could not be possible, as we came from the hands of God, designed for sociability and mutual good will, that we possessed a propensity to make one unhappy. They all sat decently and heard me out, and then got up, gave us their hands, and wished us a good journey. This brings to my mind an instance which happened some time before.

In going from school to visit my parents, who lived about forty miles distant, night overtook me.. I missed my road, and was insensible of it; till stopping at the door off tippling house to make some inquiry, the landlord informed me of it. The door being open, I saw a number of men playing cards, One of them observing me, came instantly to the door, and offered to pilot me. Disliking the motion, but much more the appearance of the man, I told him there was no occasion for it; I could find the way on being informed. He persisted, and said he would go with me as far as one Culls, who kept a public house on the road, that I ought to have gone by. 

This Cull I knew to be a magistrate. I rode off, and he soon overtook me. I conceived the man had some bad design; and I knew I had some thick woods to pass through. I told him if he would pilot me to the tavern, I would treat him. We soon got into the right road; and I knew we soon had to pass another house of evil fame. When we arrived at it, he asked me to stop, for he must. I told him, no, I knew the way. He said he would soon overtake me. I rode. Some distance, stopt, and observed his motions. He called out a man from the house, and whispered to him. The man went in, and soon returned with a large coat, which - he took, together with something which he put under the coat. I then pushed on, he overtook me, and began to converse. He asked me if I did not sometimes meet with difficulties on the road. I told him none, but what I got through with. He asked, if I had not sometimes a charge of money with me: I told him, none, but what I had use for. He asked me, if I did not always go armed. I told him, those, who gave me occasion to use them, should best know that. He said with an oath, he thought so. As we were entering a dark spot in the woods, I kept my horse close to his side, and put one hand on his thigh, that I could feel every motion he made. In this way, we passed through the wood to a wide plain, which I knew lasted to the tavern, I went to the opposite side of the road, and kept my eyes upon him. Being near to the tavern; I told him he should soon have a treat. He said, he did not want to stop, if I was going farther, he would bear me company a few miles. Having arrived at the tavern, I turned up to the door, and called for the landlord. The man kept urging me to go on. The landlord being in bed, asked who was there. I told him it was his duty to come and see. He came to the door, opened it, and asked what I wanted, I answered, the first thing was to take that man into custody. The man turned his horse, and rode off in haste. After telling the justice the story, I rode home to my fathers.From this digression I return to my narrative.

Mr. Thomas and myself, the next morning, proceeded on our journey, and reached the neighbourhood, where divine service was performed, the next day: a number gathered together, and were very attentive. After Mr. Thomas had preached two sermons, the people kept their seats. He then spoke in a low voice to me: “I wish you would say something to the people, as they continue in waiting.” He was overheard by some, who instantly begged I would. I replied, that I had no right to preach; but if they wished to hear a repetition of the substance which had just been delivered to them; and if they would allow me a few minutes to collect, and recollect; I would endeavour to repeat it. This, (they consenting to,) I did, Mr. Thomas, appointed a sermon, the next day twelve miles distant; and also another in that neighbourhood, at the same time. I thought it was a mistake, and whispered to Mr. Thomas, he had made a mistake. He said, he had not. I saw through his design, and meant to stick by him. I told him, I.did not mean because I had got abroad, to preach without license. He acknowledged he had been precipitate; but begged me to stay and meet the people, and pray and converse with them, if I did no more. I observed their anxiety to hear, and a considerable number gathering together, I began to pray and exhort. Their zeal to hear encouraged me to proceed.

Among them was an elderly man, who professed to be a friend, or Quaker; who tarried till the others had generally retired.- He told the man of the house, he wanted to converse with the speaker. As soon as he found an opportunity, he thus began addressing himself to me: "I came on purpose to day to hear thee preach, and believe a great deal that I heard, I was brought up a friend and did not believe some of thy doctrines; and I want to converse with thee on the subject, if we can do it in love." I told him I was perfectly willing; and that if we did converse it should be in love; for if I felt otherwise myself, or if I saw him warm, I should quit. I desired him to mention what he had to say. He said, he understood me "to hold election, original sin," and if I rightly recollect, "regeneration by grace, and final perseverance in grace, &c." I told him, he had understood me right. I did hold them, and meant to hold them out to the people, as the doctrines of the gospel of Jesus Christ; and I thought I could prove them to him, by reason, by scripture, and by his own experience, if he had the spirit, which I supposed he professed to have. He replied: "thou hast said a great deal, and I wish thee to begin thy argument." I first tried to reason thus: "that as we saw infants, from their, birth, were subjects of pain, anguish, and death, it was unreasonable to suppose a being, infinitely good, would inflict this great penalty on beings perfectly innocent,. pure, and blameless; neither was there any way to hope for the salvation of them after death, but through God's electing grace in Christ." 

But I need not mention the arguments I used. He stopped me by saying; there was reason in what was said, but he wished for proofs from scripture. I produced a number of passages. He then observed, there were other passages, which he thought were against me. I told him; I supposed that all the contradiction was in us, and therefore he might either reconcile them, or I would attempt to do it, which I did. He then mentioned my undertaking to do it by his own experience; which I did, and he assented. He mentioned dress, preaching for money, outward ordinances, and concluded by observing; that he had been prejudiced by education, and that he never had submitted himself before to a free inquiry; which he meant should be the case, in future.

The next day, Mr. Thomas, had a meeting, on the way to the place, where we were to meet Mr. Miller. After he had finished preaching, the people kept their seats as they did before. An old man among them thus addressed me: "We are as sheep without a shepherd, perishing for lack of vision; and if you have a regard for our souls, do endeavour to say something to us." I spoke to them for some time. We then proceeded to meet Mr. Miller. He informed us in what state the people were. We examined them, and found that they were not a regular church. We examined those that offered, and those who gave satisfaction, we received, and constituted a new church. 

Out of the whole that offered, there were only three received. Some openly declared, they knew they could not give an account of experiencing a work of grace, and therefore need not offer. Others, stood ready to offer, if a church was formed. The three before-mentioned were constituted, and six more were baptized, and joined with them. After the meeting ended, a number of old members went aside, and sent for me. They expressed their deplorable state, and asked me, if I would meet with them that evening, and try to instruct them. They were afraid the ministers blamed them. They had been misled; but it was not their fault, and they hoped I would pity them. I told them I would with all my heart; and endeavoured to remove their suspicion of the ministers. They met, and I spoke to them from these words: “They being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.” I hope I was assisted to speak to them in an impressive manner; and they to hear, at least some of them, so as to live. They afterwards professed, and became zealous members, and remained so, I believe, until their deaths.
Hopewell (NJ) Old School Baptist Meeting House

On my return to pursue my studies, I passed through Hopewell, where was Mr. Eaton. He informed me that a report prevailed that I was preaching in Virginia; and lest it should injure my character, as going disorderly into the ministry, he advised me to stay till after the Lord's day, that he might call a church meeting for the purpose of settling the matter. A meeting was called, and I was arraigned as being guilty of disorder. I wished them to exhibit the charge, and proofs. They had none, but informed me that travellers had passed through there and reported it, and they wished I would give them a relation of the matter. 

I told them, it was the first time I knew the accused party called as the only evidence in the cause; however, I would give them as just and impartial a relation as I could; which I did. They then asked me what I thought of my own conduct, whether I did not think I had been disorderly. I told them, I considered this question more extraordinary than the other. I had not only given evidence, at their request; but was now called on to judge in a cause, where I was the accused party. Here, I ought, in justice to Mr. Eaton, to say, though he called the meeting, he was as little active as possible. 

One of the elders asked me, if I proposed to persevere. I replied, it was not probable that the same occurrences would take place; if they did, I.thought I should not do wrong, or even be disorderly in God's sight. Instead of repenting, my own conscience acquitted me. I wished to return to my studies, and that it was now with them, to decide on my conduct. Mr. Eaton proposed to the church, to call me to preach before them, before I returned, And that my exercise at home might be as public as, and consonant with, that I observed abroad, I was chosen. 

A time was appoised, and I preached. While I was at school, I embraced all my leisure moments to write on some texts of scripture; and of what I then wrote, I now availed myself by using them. The church then ordered me to come and preach to them a month after; which command I punctually obeyed. They then proposed my attendance the next month, to which I objected, because it was some distance, consumed time, and interrupted my studies. They proposed another examination, to which they invited some neighbouring ministers, who met, examined, and made me a licenced preacher. I then intended to return and complete my education ; but was prevented by frequent interruptions.

An elderly minister, eminent for his purity and usefulness, enjoined it upon me, to attend and assist him at his next communion season. This minister being much engaged in the school, frequently exchanged with the neighbouring ministers; and was the next Lord's day, to exchange with "Mr. Richards" Perhaps Elder Lewis Richards mentioned in the Philadelphia Association Minutes in several places.", of Rahway. On Saturday afternoon, I met him on the road. He told me where he was going, and for what; but said that meeting me had altered his mind. He said, he had understood I was regularly authorised to preach; and that I must preach to his people. He told me he would keep Mr. Richards at home, and that I must promise that I would go to meeting; and if his congregation did not insist on my preaching, he would excuse me; and not otherwise. My obligations to him were too great for me to refuse; but I was exceeding averse to it. 

My instructor was a preacher in this place; and the ablest ministers of the Presbyterian order, usually preached to large congregations. I did not wish to undertake; but attempt it I must, and did. Some time after, attending Mr. Carman's communion, where there was a large congregation, a great many applications to preach were soon pressed upon me. A young Baptist at Morristown gave me a call. This with many others so interrupted my studies, that I was compelled to give up a regular course of study, and turn my attention entirely to divinity.

I soon after made Morristown a temporary home. The church, or rather the members of it, were but few, and much scattered through several Presbyterian congregations; viz. in Basking Ridge, Mendham, Morristown, and Passaic. I was kept constantly employed in my attendance, on Lord's days, at those places, alternately; and once a week in preaching, where I put up, with Mr. Jones. We also held meetings at private houses, in the respective towns aforementioned. I also often visited Black-river, where there was a young and destitute church, which employed so much of my time, that my studies were much interrupted. On Lord's days, large assemblies of young people attended from the different neighbourhoods aforesaid. They were open and familiar in their conversation: yet there were no very promising appearances of reformation.

In this state, I continued, till the next association; when an application was made from Opocken, for assistance: some difficulty subsisting between the church and their minister, which they could not settle. The church at Blueridge applied for a person to administer the ordinances. As no ordained minister could be found, that could go, I was urged to accept the ordination, and undertake the journey. I pleaded my youth and inexperience ; but the messengers from those churches expressed their wishes that I should be sent. I objected in vain, and was prevailed on to accept ordination, and to undertake the journey. I tarried there much longer than I meant to have done, when I set out; having an intention of being married on my return home. When I arrived at Opocken, the Lord opened the way, and the difficulty appeared amicably adjusted to mutual satisfaction, and the wound healed. I then went to Kotockton, and preached; and appointed a meeting, the next Lord's day, at Mr. John Gozzin's: the Lord's day following, I was appointed to administer the Lord's supper to them.

[Excerpts from Biographical Memoirs of the Late John Gano (NY: Southwick & Hardcastle, 1806)]

No comments:

Post a Comment

Thanks for commenting. If an answer is needed, we will respond.